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Blackmagic Goes 4K with S35 Global Shutter Sensor for $4K, and a Pocket Cinema Camera for $1K!

We’ve all been speculating that this year’s NAB show would be a major one in terms of new cinema-style cameras at incredibly low price points. After Blackmagic Design shook up the cinema camera world last year, the market seemed destined for another company to swoop in an steal the BMCC’s thunder. However, a photo of two brand-spankin’ new Blackmagic Cinema Cameras has been leaked, and it’s definitely real. It appears that Blackmagic has done it again, and their thunder is locked down in a vault that would leave even Danny Ocean and his team of 13 stumped. Check out the photo below for the limited details that we have at this point.

Jim Geduldick posted this on Twitter:


Blackmagic on the takeover new cams Super 35 4k production & S16 pocket cam. #4k http://t.co/kwR71ltQfA
@Filmbot
Jim Geduldick


For those of you having a difficult time reading those fuzzy little letters on the boxes, here’s what they say:

Blackmagic Production Camera 4K

Compact 4K camera with large super-35 sensor, global shutter, Ultra HD and 4K support, built-in SSD recorder, touch LCD metadata entry, compressed CinemaDNG RAW and ProRes recording, Thunderbolt and EF lens compatibility, Includes DaVinci Resolve and UltraScopes.

Blackmagic Pocket Cinema Camera

Ultra-portable super-16 digital cinema camera with super wide 13 stops of dynamic range. Super 16 sized 1080p HD sensor, built in SD card reader, High resolution LCD, ProRes and Lossless CinemaDNG RAW recording, Active Micro Four Thirds lens compatibility, Micro HDMI monitoring with Overlays.

There are some really significant bits in this photo, the largest of which are the full-size sensor and the considerable upgrade in terms of resolution. Plus, a global shutter on a camera in this price-range is absolutely unheard of, the nearest competitor likely being the F55. I’m also highly intrigued by the phrase, “Compressed CinemaDNG RAW” recording. If Blackmagic has managed to considerably shrink the size of their DNG RAW frames, this camera will likely prove a much more affordable option for shooting RAW due to the amount saved on data storage. Overall, this camera looks to be a serious production tool with serious production features.

The Pocket Cinema Camera looks to be another interesting release. At a price that competes with low-end DSLR’s, and with cheap SD cards as a recording medium, the camera is well-positioned to be the perfect entry level cinema camera for folks who couldn’t quite afford the original BMCC. Not to mention that it has some seriously potential as a crash cam on higher end productions. Lastly, there will be an official announcement tomorrow regarding these cameras (and NFS will have awesome coverage of it, of course), so keep your eyes wide open and your ears peeled, because it’s sure to be an exciting day.

To me, it seems pretty clear now that Blackmagic means some serious business when it comes to manufacturing cinema cameras. But what do you guys think? Do these new cameras have you excited? Let us know in the comments.

Link: Blackmagic — Super 35 4K production and s16 pocket cam — Jim Geduldick — Twitter

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Description image 244 COMMENTS

  • Fresno Bob on 04.8.13 @ 2:53AM

    This is the one I’ve been waiting for.

    Had a feeling that if I went on the MFT waiting list, something better would be announced before I got one.

  • They said last fall that creating a S35 would not be ideal because of how much the thing would cost vs. S16, and here we are now with a $1k cost difference…

    This has to probably upset quite a few BMCC owners that recently received their 2.5k cameras 5+ months later than they should have.

  • Ok, now you’ve got my attention. The question is… does anyone actually trust them to deliver the goods?

  • 128GB SanDisk SDXC card is $140 at BH and max. read/write speed is 45MB/s.

  • Was waiting for the camera that would make me sell my 5D mark 3 in the same price range. Found it.

  • 4K for $4K? Game over.

  • Kenneth Merrill on 04.8.13 @ 3:03AM

    If only it weren’t a touch screen again…

    • Kenneth Merrill on 04.8.13 @ 3:06AM

      Haha, as soon as hit submit I realized what a spoiled ass I’m being. This is awesome! If it can ship on time, perform more consistently than the last model, and I can see my aperture from the get-go, then I would be lucky to have this thing.

  • Now how long will it take to get this on the street? The track record for getting the cameras to the film makers has not been great. I don’t want to wait on a list forever and then by the time I get the camera they announce the next line of cameras that bursts my excitement of the camera I am already waiting for.

  • I’m looking forward to seeing this one at the booth… hopefully they will have a real one out this week – not just a banner.

  • Stu Mannion on 04.8.13 @ 3:14AM

    Amazing. I wonder where they got the sensor from? Hoping it’s the Toshiba one in the Nikon D5200.

  • Dude, the mini could be a great step up from my GH2. I’d love to just go all out and get the new 4K version, but at my current skill and income level there isn’t a point. I’d rather upgrade to the small one and then once I prove I can make money, I’ll upgrade. Wow, this is just exciting…

    By the way, was that picture taken from a camera phone from the ’90s? Like a god damn UFO video!

  • “Whoa,” as they say.
    Laforet’s lauded stabilizer might be a nice evolution of that market, and one destined to be used across many a professional production, but if we’re talking about “game changers” here, then nothing compares to this.
    Blackmagic has beaten Red to the punch in releasing an almost universally affordable 4K camera. 4K for $4k is now a reality, and any of the manufacturers that recently entered to the cheap 4K camera marketplace must be sweating non-magical bullets.
    Sony’s newly-revealed line of small 4K cameras now have a direct competitor at a startling price point. Canon’s 1DC, previously one of the cheapest 4K cameras out there, is now teetering on the edge of irrelevance for those who don’t need stills capability.

  • Will they tell us exactly how many cameras they intend making? Since their last camera is still not readily available…

  • If they were available right now, I’d buy one each, but I hate waiting.. so regardless of the release history of BM I’m gonna pretend I didn’t hear this.. I can’t help but think if they said: why yes they’re ready built and tested and we’re just building up stocks then that would actually be exciting.. It’s like these guys are anti zen, they’re always trying to make me liven the future! ;)

  • Okie dokie!
    Take my money BM!
    THIS is what I have been waiting for.

  • Stu Mannion on 04.8.13 @ 3:23AM

    Lets hope that the 4k camera also records 1080p Prores at up to 60fps.

  • Also, $1000 for 1080p ProRes and Cinema DNG RAW?
    People might not like the S16 sensor size, but there’s really nothing even remotely close to those specs otherwise. With good on-board software functionality and lens compatibility, it suddenly becomes a tremendous value.

    (… now the only bit that could make this announcement perfect would be that the BMPC actually uses the EF-M mount instead of the regular EF-S one, enabling it to be compatible with many more lenses, etc.)

    • It’ a Micro 4/3 mount not an EF ;-)

    • It’s a Micro 4/3 Active mount not an EF ;-)

      • As I abbreviated in parenthesis, I was talking about the BMPC or Blackmagic Production Camera, the actual name of Blackmagic’s 4K camera, which has an “EF-compatible lens mount.” That said, I can see where you might have been confused, since I was talking about the Pocket Camera for the rest of the post before then.

  • Global Shutter, super 35, and black magics legendary dynamic range.

    Well, game over. Red and Arri might as well sell off the remainder of their factories for scrap.

    Jim Jannard is having some seriously loose bowel movements over this.

  • Wow. Thrilling, and so many more questions!

    - How much compressed is compressed?
    - I guess there is some option for higher fps in the production camera, but will they have managed to cram in 1080p50 / 1080p60 in the pocket cinema camera?
    - Considering the tiny form factor on the pocket cinema camera, how long will a battery last…

    Nonetheless the Pocket Cinema Camera would be very interesting for me :)

  • David Stewart on 04.8.13 @ 3:36AM

    The super 16 with 13 stops in my pocket is exactly what i have been waiting for to replace my ’550D on the go travel shooter.

  • Dope! Where do I preorder? Rock on BM.

  • kemalettin sert on 04.8.13 @ 3:46AM

    i wish they can ship these in 5 years…still %90 of bmc orders not completed yet

  • I wonder if RED has their lawyers on it?

    • Sony announced the other day that they’re suing RED for patent infringement (seven patents, irrc). Not sure if it’s been covered on this site.

  • Yes, groundbreaking cameras indeed. Allthought: who made the 4K sensor ?

    Allso, considering how much 4K material takes resources, are they really gonna make something worthwhile in that form factor ? There is still a reason why for example Sony F55 has a fan in both camera body and external recorder…

  • I think this a wonderful announcement, however, does anybody know what “compressed CinemaDNG RAW” means? Would that be like Cineform Raw or something? One of the key points I believe….

  • R.I.P. Canon “Cinema EOS”. Especially the 1DC. 8bit, psuedo-4K, DSLR dynamic-range, jello-city, $12,000? Hahahaha!

    • hey Age of Enlightenment – I totally agree!

    • Don’t forget the passing of the Sony NEX-FS700.

      • Actually, the Sony F700 is one of the cameras offering several competitive advantages over this camera. I wouldn’t count on this new BMC offering much in the way of high frame rates. The Sony F700 still offers the best bang for the buck for slow mo acquisition.

    • But it’s made of magnesium alloy and is weather-sealed!

  • Black Magic Design steps up the dream game but seriously needs to step up the delivery game, cant just live for ever on unicorn tales! Get your game on!! At least 15,000 units can be sold if deliverable.

  • Another great excitement from Black Magic Company, This time i ll be exited when people will get hands on these camera, i am still on a waiting list for the last released camera it was exactly one year ago.

    Hope fully they(BM) have learned this from first experience and supply the cameras to the people on time.

  • Harry Pray IV on 04.8.13 @ 4:34AM

    I’m so happy that what I’ve been hoping for is true! BlackMagic is absolutely the best thing that’s happened to cinema in a LONG time. Hopefully their compression is open source too! I’m glad I never supported the companies that hold onto IP and use it to cripple us in post.

  • I bought the 5d3 knowing the RAW game was gonna take off like a hoodlum caught in the act. 5D3 holds it’s value no problem so when this bad boy is tested and ready I can sell the 5d3, having spent a few hundred dollars in the end and put that cash towards picking one of these suckers up.
    This is truly exciting. The bigger sensor is the clincher for me – couldn’t handle the crop sensor it has right now. I’m just happy to see BM pushing the envelope. The 1k cam is quite impressive as well. Raw for 1k in such a tiny package. You could have 3 cam setup inconspicuously, and end up with some seriously hot footage with all that RAW info.
    Others will have to follow!

  • The Observer on 04.8.13 @ 4:41AM

    Wow! Game-changer!

    Goodbye to my Canon 5D Mark Deux!

    Time Get Into the 4K Game

  • Insane.

    Just think what’ll come along next year at NAB…

    • Chris Lambert on 04.8.13 @ 4:54AM

      Best wait til next NAB before purchasing anything, but then it’ll only be outdated at the next NAB so I’m going to wait til next NAB NAB.

      Or I could go make stuff…

      • It won’t necessarily be outdated – but there will be something new. This has nothing to do with holding back on creative output.

        • Chris Lambert on 04.8.13 @ 5:26AM

          Oh yeah absolutely didn’t intend it as a dig at yourself. Just the mentality a lot of people have that as soon as we enter May it’s “I’m waiting till NAB” mentality

  • Whoa! Global shutter S35 4k….

    “Ultra HD and 4K support”…. Does that mean the 4k will be recorded externally? If so… I’m not quite as excited. If it is internal… Then my recent second hand scarlet purchase isn’t looking as awesome value. Global shutter would be sensational.

  • I’ts April 1st today?
    Do they learned about their faults of the first camera?
    Will these have a format and delete function? :D
    Will these can record without dropping frames?
    And I guess getting rid of moire would be too much for this money…

  • And answer from Red: they bought the Tessive Time Filter tech to “simulate” global shutter… Last price from Tessive 1950, – dollars for kit.

    Price with Red label on it 4500,- dollars…

    Shame that it still inferior to real global shutter (like in Sony F55 or new BM camera), you lose at least two stops. Not really usefull with old Epics or Scarlets.

  • Amazing I want both! This will be the ‘game changer’ from NAB 2013 forget what Vincent said about MoVI. I wonder if it is the sCMOS sensor from BAE systems. 100fps@2.5k, global shutter and 13 stops. Also wonder if the size of the production camera will increase over the current model. Blackmagic take my money!!

  • My question is:
    This camera will sell this year or in 2015 nab?

  • Dragon’s out and Red now has global shutter. This is nice for people on a budget. But at only 13 stops… its tough to take seriously these days.

    • Electrically controlled semi-transparent LCD-panel in front of sensor IS NOT a true “global shutter”. It is Red hype once again.

      Bit like Dragon DR, that was first 18 stops. Then it was 20 stops.

      Now when the Dragon cmos is finally shipping, it is “Epic MX DR + 3 stops”.

      Which in real life means about 15 stops. Very good, but nothing like “18-20 stops”.

      • You’re claiming Epic MX DR is 12 stops? What?

        Whatever; I’ve gotten so used to the DR on the Alexa and Epic that I don’t even think about it when doing stupid shit like shooting actors in shadow with intense sunlight in the exact wrong direction. I wouldn’t be able to work with a camera limited to 13 stops.

        And if you’ve ever used a tessive, while it isn’t perfect, it does get rid of a lot of the downsides, and electronically variable ND has a huge number of applications.

        My money’s already in line for a Dragon.

    • Seriously? 13 stops at this price point is great. The new $150k Phantom Flex “only” has 11.

    • Maybe for big time film makers its tough to take seriously, but for me, it’s like a step up into the bigger game. So for you red and high-end Sony users, good for you that you can afford that stuff. Not a dig at anyone by any means. But let us little guys have our moment in the sun if you will please?

  • I am as exited about the pocket S16 than to the S35 camera.

  • Wow, how pissed is anyone who just threw down money on bmcc…

    • Not at all. My guess is demand for the BM ProdCam will be immense. I’ll shoot with my original BMCC until the ProdCam becomes available. Anyway, technology moves fast (for all companies except Canon, Panasonic et al). We have to get used to it. Buyers of the original BMCC should not be expecting Blackmagic to hold back with new products.

    • Very true! I was going to buy the BMC last year but then I decided to wait, I thing the wait was worthy, hope there wont be any dalay

    • Also, it looks like the two cameras have different strengths. Production Camera: resolution and global shutter. Original Cinema Camera: dynamic range.

    • They shouldn’t be upset really. This is a different camera for people with different needs. If they bought for what they needed, they should be ok. If they bought because their eyes got big and had a sudden urge to empty their wallets, that’s their fault. Early adopter syndrome strikes again

  • Anthony Marino on 04.8.13 @ 6:41AM

    Good morning! Wow, woke up to this news (highly impressed) also got a text from my buddy saying convergent designs odyssey monitor/recorder has 2k (continuous 2k recording at 240 fps) and 4k support for the fs700. I’m excited and would like to say thanks for the great coverage this year guys. :)

  • Jaw hits floor wallet opens to no money for new equipment. Looks like I got some work to do to save up luckily I know black magic will give me enough time to save up. Hopefully we can get an external battery with this camera!

    • Chris Lambert on 04.8.13 @ 7:04AM

      battery really is a non issue my first camera the EX3′s batteries were £100+ per battery which would get you 4hr’s.

      This camera has devices already that can take Sony’s more commonly available and considerably cheaper batteries meaning for £200 could probably get a ridiculous level of running time.

  • no word on the DR of the 4K one though, which is suspicious since global shutter reduced DR.

  • Sounds good but you wont see these until 2014. They already have a camera they cant deliver on time, adding 2 more to that line is not just too realistic…

    • Rumors saying that Blackmagic learned from their production and shipping mistakes with the BMCC and camera will start shipping this summer. Let’s hope thats true.

  • CinemaDNG already has the option of lossless (roughly 2:1 to 2.5:1) — just nobody has bothered to implement it until now. It’s a shame they didn’t go with CineForm RAW, as it has more compression options: uncompressed (essentially CinemDNG), lossless, and lossy.

    • Maybe they couldn’t go with Cineform. Cineform has a license from RED for the compression scheme which is based on wavelet. I don’t think that RED would have liked it.

      Compared to the Kinefinty it may sell way more so maybe they weren’t allowed to get Cineform

      And anyway, Cineform means getting a license and that means, more expensive Cameras…

      Personally my very happy that they went with the Cinema DNG compressed, that’s going to be fine. File size should be halved, that’s great!

      • I believe CineForm RAW predates Redcode (which Red has acknowledged in its patent filings), and it’s freely licenseable from GoPro. David Newman has stated that the CF license would be cheap, and,given the volume of units that BM would be dealing in (if they could ramp up their camera manufacturing), I believe it would be a nominal additional fee.

  • 4K for $4K… s35 and global shutter? uhm cough… cough… drool… ehm… Please do elaborate… :D

    Oh, and DaVinci is still included for the 4K cam? And a s16 raw 1080p for 1K? Even cutting in on the Bolex market?

    If they continue like this (and get us some fixes to firmware), they could get a rather large part of both the Nikon and Canon HDSLR-market (the stills-crowd though wouldn’t likely notice it)

    Any word on sensor-aspect ratio? is it 16:9 or maybe even a whoopin’ 4:3 or 3:2 enabling true 2:1 anamorphics? One can only dream…

    I would say “Shut up and take my money!” but that money is non-existant right now, no fault of BMCC of course

    • “I would say ‘Shut up and take my money!’ but that money is non-existant right now, no fault of BMCC of course”

      So’s the camera, at least for purchase. It’s $4K — between now and it release, you probably will be able to save up enough cash.

    • Someone posted a link earlier in this thread about the new cinemaDNG 1.4 details. One of the interesting aspects was it seemed to infer that cinema DNG actually always records the full size of the sensor and then crops it down to 16:9 but the new version would have the option of restoring the 4:3 aspect ratio. That was my understanding anyway I might have just read it wrong. Have a look yourself there’s a link in one of the earlier comments.

      • Actually looking again I think I might have got it wrong, I think it’s referring to stills only.

  • This is amazing. ONE problem that many people aren’t talking about:

    What the hell are we going to call these things? Blackmagic need to give them some real names haha, even just some numbers or something!

  • this camera and my arri super 16mm and I’m set till next year’s NAB.

  • I always said it might need a product like this to make me interested. Nice efforts by Canon, KineRAW and Digital Bolex, but it’s only now that i can say: “I’m interested.” 4K (luxury), Super35 (very reasonable), Global shutter (obligatory!!!) and CinemaDNG RAW (ok not real RAW, which would be occasionally interesting, but even professional TV programs don’t record RAW most of the time) and all that for about 3000 €. Hello, Beauty!

    Greets,
    Matt

    • Not real RAW? what do you mean?

    • Cinema DNG is real RAW. It’s uncompressed. It’s the realest RAW there is. RED RAW is compressed RAW, arguably less raw. I’ve now said the word RAW so many times that it sounds strange.

    • “Less RAW” doesn’t mean a thing…

      A Compressed RAW is still RAW. A RAW file is just an non-debayered image, Redcode and DNG Compressed are non-debayered so they’re RAW.

      RAW has nothing to do with compression or lack of.

      • Whopps! I got a sh**load of things messed up in my previous post. ProRes was the target, but my bullet hit CinemaDNG. Sorry for that one. Of course you guys are right! All my remarks were actually referring to ProRes instead of uncompressed formats. The Alexa, for example, does record compressed ProRes and it’s used instead of RAW formats in a lot of TV productions, at least here in Germany, because of the wide use of Final Cut. On second thought, it also would have been a big surprise if Black Magic would deliver less image quality in what in all other regards is a clear upgrade to the 2.5K BMCC. Sorry, guys!

  • Industry destroyed (in a good way :))…. wow

    • Arri, RED and Sony will not see this as competition as the 4000$ price-tag aims more at semi-professionals. Then again, from a technical point of view Blackmagic offers a lot of features that most cameras even in the 20000$ area don’t have which should put a lot of pressure towards Sony and RED and maybe even towards Arri.

      If BM can deliver, a second digital revolution might be on its way – just like when the 5Dmk2 was released. If it has effect on the pro market, we might see either massive price drops or extreme improvements on dynamic range and/or low-light performance (and probably also the introduction of 8k which I’m a lot less excited about)

  • The specs on both of those cameras are incredible. Just like the original BMCC last year, these products really expose just how much the cartel of manufacturers have been exploiting their customers. This where the technology is at.

  • I have to admit that I’m especially excited for the s16 camera! So many affordable c-mount lenses to use. I do feel bad for the Digital Bolex and Ikonoskop folks.

  • mikael_bellina on 04.8.13 @ 8:16AM

    The pocket camera looks cool, the big one is still to big for me, but lot of people doing commercial and film will be interested in ! Just theses few specs tell it would be very interesting !

    About the shipment I think Blackmagic learn from his mistakes…. But the actual BMC is still not available from B&H for exemple …

    Maybe it was a strategy to do not make the actual customer disapointed !

    Waiting for the announcement ! I’m sure they will talk about a real release date this time !

  • it took me like roughly 15 minutes to get the Danny Ocean joke.

  • Wow. This is brilliant. Now, hopefully, they should deliver these, sometime soon. Everything else becomes inconsequential. The original BMCC still awaits delivery, for 99% of people, who ordered one. If these deliver within the next 1 year, R.I.P RED and Canon C Range, and also the original BMCC. Maybe, people using their DSLRs for shooting video, will throw them, into the sea, as well … :P

  • Am really excited about the s16 $995 camera!!!! Wow this are exciting news. Am gonna get it the minute is out there! :D! Congrats on BMC

    • ha ha, correction: you are going to order it the minute it is out there, and then wait 6 months.

  • Now all they have to do is deliver :) easier said than done… I am still waiting on my EF and MFT version, so I am sorry but unless they seriously overhaul their production and QC process, I cannot realistically see this camera in my hands until mid 2014

    • I highly doubt that they would consider producing 3 cameras without overhauling their production line.

  • Preordered the Pocket Cam, let’s wait some month (years?)

  • Gentlemen – the era of the DSLR camera as filmmaking tool is over. Thank god.

  • Shut up and take my money!

  • The standard BMCC is far from perfect with its lack of clip management and dropped frames not to mention a host of other issues. So, why doesn’t BM concentrate on making a great 1080p or 2K camera rather than moving onto 4K? How often are you going to drop frames at 4K if you cant keep up with 2K?

    Don’t push what is going to be a relatively cheap camera to the limit as you will get reliability issues like we have seen. The $4000 price target is not a place to be trying 4K. It will lead to compromises.

    Make a kick arse and RELIABLE Global Shutter S35 chip @ 2k with RAW and 1080p ProRes/DNxHD options………please.

    • Get an SSD that’s on the supported list and you shouldn’t drop frames. If you buy something that’s not on the list and have a problem, it’s not Blackmagic’s fault. I mostly shoot ProRes but I have shot RAW too; I’ve never had a dropped frame on my Kingston 240GB drive.

      • Robert Thorpe on 04.8.13 @ 11:08AM

        PLUS ONE.

      • Although I’m loathe to get into a debate about SSD brands, I want to point out that even the ‘recommended’ drives have had issues (and yes, with dropped frames too) as reported by multiple users including John Brawley and the recent NoFilmSchool post on making features with the BMDCC.

        The point is that picking the right SSD is only half of the battle – the other half is how the camera processes and offloads it’s footage – the Epic basically runs on SSDs (albeit in shiny box with Red printed on it) at 5k with no dropped frames.

        (Not that I’m dissing the BMDCC! Just pointing out that the SSD brand is not the sole cause of errors).

        • I was under the impression that RED cameras regularly have issues, including dropped frames. And they cost much much more..

  • Where to order in the United States or in Europe? And which would be faster…???

  • OK, so im assuming the 4K will have to be recorded externally via the 6G SDI output?

  • I posted a question to the well-known pro cinematographer community at Cinematography.net — “Should I get the BMCC or 5D Mark III if I’m serious about making films?” — and the consensus response surprised me (I also talked to Shane Hurlbut’s assistant — same answer): “Beware the BMCC. Too many problems, too much risk. The 5D is absolutely proven. Go with it.” BM has now just screwed everybody who bought the original and waited all this time (or longer) to get a camera now rendered somewhat obsolete over a measly $1,000 difference for 4K — IF they ever really deliver on anything. And customer service will remain an issue until BM is “proven.” I wanted an original, but have decided not to take the risk based on the pro advice I just got.

    • Blackmagic guys are not stupid.
      They’ll probably give and option to turn an original BMCC pre-order into a new 4k BMCC pre-order for $1000 more, and put all those pre-orders in front on the delivery queue.
      But if those pros want to continue buying in the Canon crippled BS, more power to them.

      As of now, Blackmagic is the only company in the camera industry pushing the envelope. It it was easy, I would be doing it. Have some faith in the guys. They are doing a great job. No revolution happened fast/easy.

    • Even “professionals” don’t always know what they are talking about. Many of them carry a ton of emotional baggage when it comes to manufacturer loyalty, and it influences their opinions negatively.

      Anyone who suggests that the 5D Mk III is the better choice on the market today is completely out of his or her mind. And this comes from having used one extensively.

      • Agreed, I shoot lots of video on two Mark III’s. Even just the very limited DR kills it. The BMCC performs better but yes, is not as easy.

      • There is always a right camera for the right job, sometimes the 5d mk 3 is the right choice over a BMCC, but it depends on what your doing. Use the right tool for the right job.

      • “Many of them carry a ton of emotional baggage when it comes to manufacturer loyalty.” So true. I have noticed on the interwebs that Canon, Red and Leica have the most fervent, loyal fanboys. Sony, Nikon, Arri, Panasonic barely have a cheering section of note.

    • 5D is not a “professional camera”. As far as BMD, they provide a very good product at a great price point. As a first generation cameras, one could only expect some issues- the same was with RED. BMDCC provides truly cinema quality for a fraction of the price. For bigger budget productions Alexa is still a proven workhorse, but this is fairly close.

      • Or you could opt out for all toghether and go with a more proven workhouse than even the ALEXA for less than half the price of an Alexa.

        IM talking about a SONY F35 AKA PANASONIC GENESIS, an old camera that still till this day is still a workhouse on several tv productions around the world and even recent movies within a year ago were still shot on it.

        IT has no rolling shutter, can shoot raw or top notch 1080p from a 5k sensor with no weird highlight effects found a equally new priced sony f3

        EBAY has several SONY F35′s on sale with batteries and EVF included ,some for under 13k, The only factors would be WT and PL mount only options but hey its still cheaper and more proven than any other current digital cinema camera on the market, yes even the mighty ALEXA

    • If you always play it safe, you’ll always be behind the curve. I can’t recommend that anyone shoots a serious project on a DSLR with the BMCC available. And I don’t feel short-changed by my BMCC at all. There’s nothing sad, wrong or annoying about the march of technology — would you rather wait another 5 years for the same thing?

    • Well, then these professionals should buy what they need. If they needed 4K to begin with, then they shouldn’t have purchased a 2.5K camera. The last one was a 2.5K, clearly not intended for those that need 4K, this newer one is a big improvement for not much more money, this is true, but the professional who buys gear they don’t need isn’t wise. That’s their fault for being an early adopter. By now they’ve had time to figure out their manufacturing and get things just in order.
      Trust me, there is a reason we aren’t all camera manufacturers. Manufacturing is not an easy job, especially for a company that hadn’t ever made a camera before. There was a small chance things would go wrong with the first batch to iron out the bugs, and these guys pulled the short end of the stick. I’m personally keeping my eye on this pocket cinema camera now myself.

    • Even on a “pro advice” website, these are all opinions. Maybe it’s better if you formed your own opinion, not rely on everyone to tell you what to do. Only you can really know what you need, and while myself or anyone on here can offer help, and are happy too, it’s better to build your own tastes and preferences and opinions than it is to rely on these forums for everything. I apologize if I am sounding critical, I’m genuinely meaning to be helpful.
      I’ll even consent that I could be wrong, cause its just my opinion. If a 5D suits your needs, go for it. But if you feel a BMCC fits your needs, then go for that. But let everyone be convinced in their own mind and form a mind of their own, not let others lead us around on a forum when we have no idea who here people are, or even if they are working in Hollywood, if they are any good at what they do or not

    • Dave Mueller on 04.8.13 @ 11:10AM

      And I wouldn’t go with the 5D. If you’re going to shoot a feature and wanted to stick with Canon, use the 1D-X (which Phillip Bloom said had the picture quality that he’d wanted the 5D Mk. III to have) or the 1D-C. They’re not that much more to rent than the Mk. III (I mean, yeah, they are, but in terms of the total costs of shooting a movie, this is a pretty incremental jump for a big difference in picture quality).

      I liked the 1D-C because it shot Canon Log, and that…I can’t remember the name of the software at the moment but it could take your footage and match several different film stocks. It worked with Canon’s C500 and C300, but they speculated that the Canon Log was the same in the 100 as well and that it was likely that it would work with that camera as well. I’m thinking/theorizing it’ll work with the 1D-C also. Being that I probably won’t be able to afford a digital color technician on our budget (and thus it will be me) having a plug and play solution is a good option.

      • Software you’re thinking of is Filmconvert.

      • Not too be rude, but why go with a 1DX based soley off the words of phillip bloom, not to down BLOOM , but getting or renting a c100 would make better sense than a 1dx, its a better video camera with proper xlr options and better image quality, not too mention the opiton to get uncompressed footage via an inexpensive exteranal recorder like hyper deck or atomos

  • This is simply amazing and unexpected!
    The S35 was in everyone’s imaginary wish list and now it’s a reality (and somehow people still bitch about it).
    And the mini came out of the blue!

    I’m sure they learned from past mistakes (production, delivery…) otherwise they wouldn’t be presenting another camera that soon.

  • Ok didn’t they learn anything from the first go round? What is their obsession with Canon EF Mount.

    • You already know the answer to this I hope. Easy they’re trying to grab the HDSLR crowd. Most are Canon 5D and 7D owners. They invested in Canon and other EF glass. Providing them an upgrade while allowing them to keep their lenses is attractive.

    • EF mount makes sense on an s35 sized sensor.

    • They’re trying to capture the disgruntled Canon owners that are looking for a new camera without having to get new glass. I’m just glad to see they’re making an m4/3 alternative as well.

    • Because a micro 4/3 lens doesn’t fit a S35 sensor. It’s your only option at this size when the demo they shoot for it canon 5D/ 7D users

      • Oh no I wasn’t suggesting they do a m4/3 mount, what I’m suggesting is at this point do an interchangeable mount. Not JUSt EF mount. No this information was not published on their site YET. some guy took a photo earlier than the announcement which has yet to happen. I’m curious to know how many stops of dynamic range. Either way RED and Canon must be crapping their pants because they’ve been so cocky with their expensive ass stuff. Sony’s F55 is global shutter and $28k. So this means that Canon better do something about RAW and CHEAPER. Sorry I’m so mad at everyone’s orgasm over the 1DC. What a waste of money. It’s like that’s all Philip Bloom shoots with now. Yes I can drop $12,000 on a 1DC no problem. Pocket change. Please!!

        Now to see if Panasonic will have RAW up their sleeve as well.

  • Does anybody know where to place a pre-order? Has anyone tried yet?

  • The Pocket Cinema Camera looks like a sweet option for aerial shooting with a multi-rotor remote-controlled helicopter.

  • Casey Orion on 04.8.13 @ 10:08AM

    There have been a lot f comments about how BM has just trashed people who orderred the BMCC. Ladies and gentlemen, this is the time in which we live. Technology is hurtling forward. BM could intentionally slow down its release cycle but that is what people have complained about regarding canon. This announcement is incredible in that it democratizes technology that was previously reserved for the elite.

  • I didnt see if anyone posted this, but I talked to the guys there and both cameras release in July. They have a new sensor that will supposedly eliminate the shipping problem, and they are not going to worry about waiting to ship the 2Ks before they ship these new ones. The actual interface is basically the same as the 2K except it now has 4K. The model I used only has 400ASA available in the dark club, so no visible image on the screen, it is unknown (to them) what the top ASA will be. Also, the dynamic range went down a stop with the sensor change. The size of the camera is basically no different than the 2K as well and I asked about a PL mount and he said “we will see what people ask for, you never know”.

    • Hopefully all this comes to light soon. And if it takes as long as last time I’m gonna cry. I didn’t get a BMCC last time I got a canon 6D instead. Now this pocket model really has my insides all in a lather. If you’re there and can get more details out of them please, try for us?

      • I got to test out a pocket cinema camera and I am thoroughly disappointed. One had a cinema lens on it and the other a Voightlander and it looked out of focus even when the focus was peaked out on screen. The lcd is very low quality and has a lot of posterization. One was attached to a panasonic external monitor and it still had the focus problem. So, I would need to see footage from he camera to be convinced, otherwise RAW 1080p would be awesome.

        Also, it seemed from the menu (I may be wrong) that the 4K camera actually shoot 4K Prores 422 in addition to RAW. They did not have the raw enabled on the cameras there.

    • Excellent news@anonymous.

  • So when did $4000 bucks become professional to some of you? The 5D led the Dslr revolution and it was only $500 bucks less than this.
    Side question: Why on the poster does it say 6G SD!?

    • When did price point become the deciding factor on professional or not? Last I checked it was quality and feature set that made something professional.

  • This is great news, shoot 1080p raw as an Alexa for 1k, is awesome.
    It would be even greater news if BM announce a change in its chain of production.
    They need to speed up things.

  • Charlie Doom on 04.8.13 @ 10:24AM

    This is AMAZING news! I almost can’t believe it. For those of you wondering, it seems ordering from US distributors is faster than European Distributors. That seemed to be the case with the original BMCC, I think it comes down to the regional organization of distribution. The US is one country in a region, while Europe has many countries in the region so the orders for Europe get split among the various countries. While both regions probably get the same amount of cameras, they’re divided more in Europe. Just my guess from past experiences. Could be totally wrong, but I noticed US orders seemed to come in more consistently compared to, say, Finnish orders.

  • wow!! I was talking about compressed raw on the other thread and now this! S35, global shutter, EF mount and compressed Raw!

    Now we’re talking!

    But they need to deliver cameras faster, a lot faster.

  • 13 stops in my pocket. holy crap.

  • Hey Charlie

    thanks for that update on pre ordering…also which place in the United States is faster?

    thanks
    dio

  • David J. Fulde on 04.8.13 @ 10:55AM

    They still need to fix a host of issues:
    Ergonomics on the 4K (I am astounded that they did not fix this! The ergonomics on the 2K version was my biggest gripe with it. Why release a 2K camera when you need to have 4K of support gear to shoot with it?)
    The screen is impossible to see in daylight* (Maybe the 4K version is built with a matte screen?)
    You can’t see how much space you have left
    Dropped frames
    You can’t see, precisely, how much battery you have left

    I am FAR more excited for the Pocket Cinema Camera. Though I wonder how fast the SD cards need to be.

    Lastly: A “production” camera without SDI? What?

  • The Pocket comes into being JUST when I was finally decided to go to the GH3 from my old and suffering T2i… I cannot WAIT to see the presentation tomorrow. I want footage! The 4k for 4k is pretty great, but for web series work, a 13 stop tiny camera for that price is unreal!

    • Plus One. I JUST sold my T2i and all of my EF lenses, ordered 3 active MFT primes (14, 25, 45mm) and an 85mm manual lens. I’ve backordered GH3 I’m waiting for now. But you know what? I don’t trust BMD to get the mini out in a reasonable time, and I have clients now. I’m thinking I’ll hold on to the GH3, which has things like 60 frame 1080p and auto focus during recording, for client work, and pick up a BMD mini when it actually comes fully to market for my narrative work. And by comes fully to market, I mean when I can place an order for it and expect to receive it within 2 weeks.

  • I’m genuinely curious how the Digital Bolex team is responding to this announcement. I feel like they could have got a foothold if they just got their product to market faster, but now? Can the nostalgia of the Bolex brand retain relavence in the face of such a forward thinking company like Blackmagic?

    • DIGITAL BOLEX will probably respond the same as they have done in the past, usually with more blown out depth of field shots along with a non production/prototype. SXSW just recently past and still to this date they still do not have a working prototype of this camera, i understand the boards and production problems, but still no working prototype, they seem to be more interested in the asthetics of novalty add ons like a leather brief case strap or irrelevant hand crank. Even if they do manage to ship only a few batch of cameras like they said they would, what if all of the 15 cameras in the wild they released stop working , then what? it takes them 2 years to release 15 cams, so how long do you think it would take to replace it, Miss me with the digital Bolex

  • yessss I have been waiting for this.. I was expecting in 2016 due to shippping problem of 2.5k BMCC but BM u r amazing .. I will order both of them .. Can’t wait to see them in my hand

    • this is a thread about bmcc – there will be plenty of articles for RED. Ease off, homie – it’s unbecoming.

      • I was just giving Nab reports that werent being posted. I’m no red fanboy I don’t have one. I do however use a blackmagic which I am really looking forward to upgrading to a 4k Blackmagic whenever that comes out.

    • Fake global shutter? RED FTW!

  • Hope for Red Scarlet and dragon sensor? Epic owners can pre-order right now for $8,500
    http://www.engadget.com/2013/04/08/red-epic-dragon-sensor-updates-start-tomorrow-for-8-500/

    • Uh, take your RED spam out of this thread. Couldn’t be less relevant here.

      • I tend to disagree. I don’t really consider the BlackMagic announcements serious/relevant. I think the big piece of news today will be upgrade path from Scarlet to Epic Dragon pricing.

        • yes really more then 170 comments & you think it isn’t relevant :D..

          If i have invested money in scarlet/epic i would think same as you

        • Haha, nice try RED marketing team. It has to be a depressing day for you. Stealing your thunder, and all.

      • I think it is pretty relevant. We’re talking about the best raw sensor you can get with a few bucks that just got upgraded to 4k 35mm. I just posted this because Red announcing the sensor they have been talking about for years. Don’t attack me for bringing another camera maker in the mix. This is NAB and we are being thrown a ton of information. I’m as excited to be a film maker you should be too.

  • Does anyone know yet if the lossless CinemaDNG RAW on the Pocket Cinema Camera is done internally without the need for an external recorder?

  • Juanky Alvarez on 04.8.13 @ 11:45AM

    Lol, BM website went down just after publishing the info of this cameras.

  • gimme that pocket cam and a metabones speed booster with a Nikon mount.

  • Holy shit – in the demo BMPC model it looks like it has a Panny lens on it, which can only mean one thing – ACTIVE m43 mount. This thing is glorious.

  • And Resolve 10 have editing built in to it ??? i hope it will save money from fcpx i am going to invest

  • I can’t get on bmd’s site but is this just a 24,25,30 fps camera?

  • John Brawley posted a lot of good information about the pocket camera and the 4K production camera:

    http://johnbrawley.wordpress.com/2013/04/09/the-pocket-rocket-blackmagic-downsizes-the-bmcc-and-does-a-4k-upsize-of-the-orginal/

    Looks like 4K Compressed Raw isn’t going to be enabled out of the box. It’ll be some type of firmware update somewhere down the road….

    This is pretty interesting!

  • it’s April 9th in Oz and blackmagic agent @brawlster is way ahead of everyone with a closer look, size comparison and more images. See http://johnbrawley.wordpress.com/2013/04/09/the-pocket-rocket-blackmagic-downsizes-the-bmcc-and-does-a-4k-upsize-of-the-orginal/

  • Preordered BMPC. Really hoping they can ship by the summer. Excited that I can use the same glass as my GH3!

    • EXACTLY. The active mount makes this camera dominant. Paired with a GH3 (which gives you stills, 60P, time-lapse, weather sealing), you basically have the ultimate 1080P setup for under $3k!

    • Where did you pre-order?
      Online? Link please.

  • Where can I preorder the Pocket Camera in the US? What’s the best option right now?!

  • Yup! 4K is great, but for where my stuff is scene (mostly web, some tv) it’s a nice to have. I’d rather have the extra DR this $1000 camera will have over the Production Camera.

  • Huh. I was saving my pennies for a GH2 or GH3 for 1080p shooting. Now the choice has become a little more interesting as this seems to be a direct competitor in that price-range but with a much better codec. Hopefully BMD have their manufacturing/fulfillment issues ironed out so that I can buy one by the time I’ve got enough saved up.

  • Wow. I’m looking to expand my camera rig, but all these new options don’t make the decision easy. Loving the fact, though, that BMD has developed a cinema camera with a sensor that will do justice to EF Canon lenses. Interested to see what the first 4K RAW footage will look like.

  • Rodrigo Molinsky on 04.8.13 @ 2:10PM

    “Do these new cameras have you excited?” (from nofilmchool.com)
    Are you kidding with this question? I’m holding my tears here, almost asking for the guys from Blackmagic to take my money!

  • for the record, the camera doesnt include the DaVinci Resolve software, unlike the previous model

    • Yes it does come with the DaVinci Resolve…. Read up a little more before you make a statement.

      • Resolve lite is a free download and can work with files up to 1080p. For larger files (2.5k, 4k etc.) you need a full copy of resolve which comes with the 4k camera and the original 2.5k camera. Sounds pretty sweet to me!

      • “Yes it does come with the DaVinci Resolve…. Read up a little more before you make a statement.”

        That last sentence of yours is rather…. ironic.

        • I’ve been using Resolve Lite and it’s fine for non-complex correction and grading, and quite frankly it is a heck of a learning tool. Along with some of the excellent training out there from various sources, getting familiar with Resolve Lite is still a challenge and it is still a very useful tool. I haven’t the budget or the space for the big boy and the control surface, anyway.

  • I love BlackMagic Design for making these 2 new cameras. I’m particularly excited for the Pocket Cinema Camera as it provides nearly the same picture quality as the BMCC 2.5K in nary the size of an iPhone 5. Plus, the fact that the Micro 4/3rds mount on the body is active means that you can use your lenses fully manual or automatic. Plus, with a Metabones Speed Booster getting a S35mm image is possible. And for under a grand damn! Plus, 4K with 6G-SDI for under four grand! Are we still living on planet earth or is this heaven?

  • This is a game-changer (again!). I’m a committed Digital Bolex supporter/purchaser, and it offers some important advantages over this new BM compact, but this camera will definitely be in every DP’s jacket pocket. It doesn’t offer the frame rates of the Panasonic GH3, it doesn’t offer the flexibility of interchangeable lens mounts and XLR inputs and all the other features of the D16, but as a second/third/whatever camera, as a tool for journalists? man, it’s the cats pajamas.

  • I simply don’t know how they do it. If it sounds too good to be true, it usually is. Last year’s camera has many issues that caused people to take a second look and turn away – impractical, sensor size, files too large etc.

    Now Sony spends a fortune designing the F5 / 55 and it wows you – incredible reliable camera – top marks in everything – RED too. Now this camera comes up and does the same thing – sort of? Yes it has addressed sensor size, battery life and some other issues, but still something just doesn’t make sense. For 1/7th the price???? Let’s wait until the hype is over and the reality sets in. There has got to be a catch somewhere. It simply doesn’t add up. You’ve heard the phrase – “i’m from Missouri”. OK, until then, I’m from Missouri.

    Take 5

  • I’m both excited and shocked at the news- excited about the Black Magic’s cameras and shocked at the shortsightedness of the big companies who employ marketing experts who perhaps cannot see beyond their nose. I was talking to a camera retailer this morning in London who told me that it was only the second day from the announcement and they have already received a number of enquiries and pre-orders for the product.

  • Digital Bolex, Ikonoskop, Pana GH3, Black Magic, who next, too much for the 16mm cake

  • If the price is right 4 the 4 K cam its not much $$ as a digital bolex……..hot

  • This is really exciting, I am actually planning to go higher than the 60D that I have used for more than 2 years now, the announcement of blackmagic 4k is worth waiting for. Can you guys please advice me as regards those things that will be needed along with this camera to actually shoot a movie for a low budget producer like me. I need your suggestions as regards the cheapest rig and other things that the camera will need in order to shoot a good feature film.

    • The cheapest rig would be basically exactly the same as the costs required beforehand for a BMCC, just look around. Heaps of info on that.

      However you would need to spend more on storage and have a gruntier computer for post processing.

  • Is it me, or does the Mini Black Magic Camera look just like a Sony NEX? ;)

  • Flora Langlois on 04.10.13 @ 2:31PM

    I’m both excited but saddened by Black magic’s pocket cinema camera.
    You see, I was debating wether to get DSLR that shoots video + accessories or an actual video camera for my actual semi pro use.
    As I read on forums, it seemed that the pocket cinema would have been perfect for my budget and use, but then again, when I read that I had to pre order it and that Blackmagic had been really bad on respecting deadlines with last year’s model and had it confirmed by one of the retailers I contacted it totally scared me off. Too bad, this would have been perfect! If only they were easier to get!!

  • You can pre-order the BMCC 4K and the Pocket cam at Rule Boston Camera. Just mention Mike sent you. Our list is small so the odds of getting one sooner are much higher.

  • It’s really a nice and helpful piece of info. I am happy that you shared this helpful info with us. Please keep us informed like this. Thanks for sharing.

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